Using Raspberry Pi 0 for jOrgan

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Using Raspberry Pi 0 for jOrgan

John Reimer
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I'm setting this topic up for archival purposes.

JohnR



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(no subject)

Brian Sweetnam
This post was updated on .
Hi, I have not yet had time to install jOrgan, as I am busy with a lot of
planning, drilling and soldering on this latest organ project of my Yamaha
spinet midification. Indeed, I have a USB soundcard connected, with 8 outs
and 2 inputs. It even has optical out and inputs too, although I will not
be using them.

I am quite sure that with the port-audio backends, you will be able to have
8 audio channels for jOrgan.

This same little soundcard works out of the box, on both my LattePanda as
well as Raspberry PI. You need not manually install any drivers for it.

The onboard sound of both the LattePanda as well as Raspberry PI, is not of
adequate quality.

My other excitement over both of these wonderfully cheap computers is that,
is the Arduino co-processor and IO-pins on both of them. With the right
multiplexers, I believe the Arduino can be your MIDI encoder and interface
- I personally have not done this, but there are some guys that have used
Arduino for MIDI encoder and interface.

My next excitement is the Raspberry PI 0. Quite a while back, Julie
suggested using one Raspberry PI 0 W for one rank on a VPO.

This is really an exciting idea, to say the least.....  Using this
approach, I would sugest using a Raspberry PI 3 model B inside the console,
running you midi interface. On the PI 3 you would run jOrgan, with your
"master" disposition, and some ranks. So say for example  you have 30 ranks
in your disposition. You "could" then take 30 Raspberry PI 0  W, and
running jOrgan on each PI,  say have one or at most two ranks on said PI.
The PI 3B would send MIDI messages for stop changes, note on and off
events, and everything else, to all PI 0 W's. Of course, it would mean you
would need 30 amps and speakers. It is a lot, but I am trying to
demonstrate the possibilities of what can be done even using only humble pi
(pun intended) 😀

Last year with Graham Goode's help, I managed to run jOrgan like this in
just 2 PI 3B's, with different stops on each one, and the midi input only
on the main PI. I intend getting a couple of PI 0 W's, to test this theory.
Each PI 0 in exampke above will run headles. Imagine the distributed sound
you would get by using 30 PI 0's, with each one running even one single
rank. I think it will sound extraordinary beautiful.  There is a HiFi Berry
soundcard available in the same form factor as the PI 0 W. All the PI 0 W’s
will communicate via WiFi. If you had to build an enclosure for each stereo
amp, you could simply put the PI 0 W  and HifiBerry into the same enclosure.

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Re: (no subject)

John Reimer
Administrator
Brian Sweetnam wrote
> My next excitement is the Raspberry PI 0.

BrianS,

Thank you for your readiness to try new things. You are a great asset to our
jOrgan community. It would be interesting to know the RAM requirements of
the OS for the RPi 0. Presumably it is some form of Linux. I see that the
normal RAM is 512MB. This might mean you could accommodate much more than a
single rank in jOrgan in each unit.

30 RPi 0's would produce 30 STEREO channels, and I'm sure that the law of
diminishing returns would mean one would never actually go that far, even
for a VPO in a public situation. But the concept seems full of promise.
However, there is one downside.  A statement on the RPi website indicates
that there is an end-of-life envisaged for the RPi0. (Not before 2022, it
says, but it is going to happen).

John Reimer



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Re: (no subject)

Brian Sweetnam
This post was updated on .
I am using quad channel car amplifiers, with blade power supply units (PSU's).  Each amp will drive two 6X9 inch full range speakers, as well as a 12 inch subwoofer.  I bridge two of the four channels, and use that to drive the subwoofer.

So for each stereo pair, you will need the following:
1. Two 6X9 inch full range speakers.  I use Sony, Pioneer or Kenwood.
2. Two speaker enclosures for the two full range speakers.
3. One 12 inch Subwoofer.  Again, I generally use Kenwood, but many other brands are available.
4. One sealed or vented subwoofer enclosure.
5. One car quad channel audio amplifier.
6. One parametric equaliser.
7. One HP blade PSU.  They are available on e-bay.  They supply 12V, and I am not sure, but I do think also 3V and 5V.  I have to this point only used the 12V, to power the amplifier, as well as the parametric equaliser.  The other voltages could be used to also power the Raspberry Pi itself.
7. One Raspberry Pi 0 W (or Raspberry Pi 3 model B), depending on how many ranks you would like on that stereo pair.
8. All the woodworking skills, tools, and materials, to put the above together, in a cabinet design of your choice.  I will be installing mine on lockable castors, so that it is easy to move around. The only wiring that should come out of the speaker cabinet, is the power chord, as the cabinet will 'talk' to your console via WiFi.  You could, however, connect them via ethernet cable, should you wish to do so.
9. Optional: One touch screen, either 5, 7, or 10 inches, perhaps even smaller, should you wish to display some information on this speaker cabinet.  I think it will look quite awesome, should each cabinet be able to indicate on-screen, which stops are on that cabinet, and whether or not they have been pulled out or not.

Remember, you can use Windows Remote Desktop, to connect to the Raspberry Pi in each of these speaker cabinets, whether you do have a screen on it or not.
Regards,

BrianS
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Brian Sweetnam
I will be driving down to a Raspberry Pi shop tomorrow - a two hour drive one
way.  There are a couple of
 shops closer than 20 minutes from my home, that do sell the Raspberry Pi,
but they only carry basic stock, and no specialised add-on cards and
accessories.  This is why I will drive down to the PiShop tomorrow.
 I will be getting the following items for my experimentation with the Pi
Zero W, in order to see if I can build a stand-alone midi sound module, that
can be communicated to via Wifi only, so no directly connected midi
equipment to this box is what I have in mind.

Raspberry Pi Zero W
HifiBerry for Raspberry Pi Zero W (They have exactly the same footprint)

This shop sells various sound options for the Raspberry Pi computers
including HifiBerry, Allo, IQ Audio, as well as some 'no name' USB audio
cables - so there certainly is enough variety to choose from.  If I am
successful, I will soon take another trip, as I would want a couple of these
'stand-alone' midi sound modules, but I will incorporate them in to
stand-alone speaker cabinets, that I will build myself.

Wish me luck - I will share everything that I learn.




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Re: (no subject)

Aaron Laws
Oh cool! Godspeed!


In Christ,
Aaron Laws

On Wed, Apr 4, 2018 at 6:08 AM, Brian Sweetnam <[hidden email]> wrote:
I will be driving down to a Raspberry Pi shop tomorrow - a two hour drive one
way.  There are a couple of
 shops closer than 20 minutes from my home, that do sell the Raspberry Pi,
but they only carry basic stock, and no specialised add-on cards and
accessories.  This is why I will drive down to the PiShop tomorrow.
 I will be getting the following items for my experimentation with the Pi
Zero W, in order to see if I can build a stand-alone midi sound module, that
can be communicated to via Wifi only, so no directly connected midi
equipment to this box is what I have in mind.

Raspberry Pi Zero W
HifiBerry for Raspberry Pi Zero W (They have exactly the same footprint)

This shop sells various sound options for the Raspberry Pi computers
including HifiBerry, Allo, IQ Audio, as well as some 'no name' USB audio
cables - so there certainly is enough variety to choose from.  If I am
successful, I will soon take another trip, as I would want a couple of these
'stand-alone' midi sound modules, but I will incorporate them in to
stand-alone speaker cabinets, that I will build myself.

Wish me luck - I will share everything that I learn.




-----
Regards,

BrianS
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Re: (no subject)

jOrgan - User mailing list
In reply to this post by Brian Sweetnam
Thank you for this research project.
Counting on valuable information from you.
pk


Wednesday, April 4, 2018, 3:08:50 AM PDT, Brian Sweetnam wrote:

<snip>
I will be driving down to a Raspberry Pi shop tomorrow - 
a two hour drive one way.  

... If I am successful, I will soon take another trip, as I would want a couple of these
'stand-alone' midi sound modules, but I will incorporate them in to stand-alone speaker cabinets, that I will build myself.

Wish me luck - I will share everything that I learn.
<snip>



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Brian Sweetnam
I got up early this morning.  I am so excited about discovering this Pi Shop
near Johannesburg.  They have absolutely everything you need computer and
sound card-wise, to build a beautiful virtual organ using only Raspberry Pi.
They sell all the models of Raspberry Pi, and about 20 different models of
high quality sound cards specifically for the Raspberry Pi.  I took two
Raspberry Pi 0 W's, and one HifiBerry sound card, which is exactly the same
size as the Raspberry Pi 0 W.

I've just started it up, and it seems very responsive for such a small
computer.  I'm hoping that I have great success in running jOrgan on this
bad boy.



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Pete Theisen
This kind of stuff, if available at all in the states, is about 10x the price. Kind of unfair . . .

On 04/05/2018 12:25 PM, Brian Sweetnam wrote:
I got up early this morning.  I am so excited about discovering this Pi Shop
near Johannesburg.  They have absolutely everything you need computer and
sound card-wise, to build a beautiful virtual organ using only Raspberry Pi. 
They sell all the models of Raspberry Pi, and about 20 different models of
high quality sound cards specifically for the Raspberry Pi.  I took two
Raspberry Pi 0 W's, and one HifiBerry sound card, which is exactly the same
size as the Raspberry Pi 0 W.

I've just started it up, and it seems very responsive for such a small
computer.  I'm hoping that I have great success in running jOrgan on this
bad boy.



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BrianS
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Re: (no subject)

samibe
I don't know. It seems pretty comparable to me.

https://www.pishop.co.za/store/raspberry-pi-boards
vs.
https://www.pishop.us/product-category/raspberry-pi/pi-boards/

Though you wouldn't be able to walk into a shop in the US, the online prices
seem reasonable.

Sam



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Re: (no subject)

Aaron Laws
In reply to this post by Pete Theisen
On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 12:36 PM, Pete Theisen <[hidden email]> wrote:
This kind of stuff, if available at all in the states, is about 10x the price. Kind of unfair . . .


Being a United Statesian, I don't think we should complain about that. International complaints belong to citizens of other countries and are invalid in the United States in general ;-) 

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Pete Theisen
If they can sell those things for less than a dollar US over there then we are paying WAY too much over here. Same as prescription drugs . . .

We aren't all high - paid clergypersons. lol :-)


On 04/05/2018 05:04 PM, Aaron Laws wrote:
On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 12:36 PM, Pete Theisen <[hidden email]> wrote:
This kind of stuff, if available at all in the states, is about 10x the price. Kind of unfair . . .


Being a United Statesian, I don't think we should complain about that. International complaints belong to citizens of other countries and are invalid in the United States in general ;-) 


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Re: (no subject)

samibe
This post was updated on .
Pete, unless my math is off (or we're looking at different components), I
don't see an issue.
From the previous links I posted: A Raspberry Pi 3 Model B is around $35
(plus shipping) in the US and around $45 (543 South African Rand) in South
Africa. It costs more in South Africa than in the US (for almost everything that both site have).

Back on topic: Brian, Keep us posted. I would like to do something like this in the
future after I get my organ midified.

Sam



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Pete Theisen
If that is true, that is fair enough. When I shopped them a year or two ago Brian was getting them way cheaper than I could get them here. I didn't get one since I couldn't afford it.

Maybe I can afford one now . . .

On 04/05/2018 06:46 PM, samibe wrote:
Pete, unless my math is off (or we're looking at different components), I
don't see an issue.
>From the previous links I posted: A Raspberry Pi 3 Model B is around $35
(plus shipping) in the US and around $45 (543 South African Rand) in South
Africa. It costs more in South Africa than in the US. 

Back on topic: Keep us posted. I would like to do something like this in the
future after I get my organ midified.

Sam



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Re: (no subject)

samibe
That makes sense. Those Pi boards kept selling out in the US a couple years
ago and everyone wanted them. I would have started learning about them
sooner if I could have got my hands on one back then.


Pete Theisen wrote
> If that is true, that is fair enough. When I shopped them a year or two
> ago Brian was getting them way cheaper than I could get them here. I
> didn't get one since I couldn't afford it.
>
> Maybe I can afford one now . . .





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Re: (no subject)

Paul Kealy
In reply to this post by Brian Sweetnam
Brian, this is wonderful for you to share.

I attended a special workshop seminar sponsored by Raspberry Pi and they shared absolutely no knowledge of MIDI applications whatever. Waste of time here in SoCal. Almost like it was no part of the computer raison d'etre.

So I am really looking forward to whatever you have to share.

My desire is to create an instrument of 4 or 5 manuals in JOrgan singing as many separate speakers playing the King of Instruments as separate "organ ranks" to raise awareness of the variety of the orchestra the organ was intended to emulate.

At present I use software package that sounds wonderful.
However, it does not enable me to create my own instrument to bring the total variety alive, that I aim to ameliorae with jOrgan performing from my console with all those manuals and two touchscreens.

Currently I operate several instrument consoles.

Thank you for reaching out to help the rest of us.

pk





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Re: (no subject)

Brian Sweetnam
Hi Pete,

In South Africa, I have to pay $45 for a Raspberry Pi 3 model B, and I see
that in Florida you can buy the same thing for $35.  It is way more
expensive here in South Africa.  

The B+ has not released for sale in South Africa, because the relative
authorities have not yet given their stamp of approval, that will allow the
retailers to sell them - they do seem to already have stock of them, but
they are not allowed to sell them yet.

I hope you can get your Raspberry Pi 3 model B (or B+) soon. You can order
your here Pete:

Raspberry Pi 3 model B:
https://www.adafruit.com/product/3055

or
Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+
https://www.adafruit.com/product/3775

They are both priced at $35 for you.

However, for me, they would be as follows:
Raspberry Pi 3 Model B:   $45.06.
Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+: $48.47.

That is quite a big price difference for you and for me.

This morning I managed to start jOrgan on the Raspberry Pi 0 W, but I still
have to get the sound working - it is still quiet.

Regards,

Brian.





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RoyR
Hi, Brian,

               No sound comes out...

Must try that one, the way I'm playing lately it could only be an improvement!     *:)) laughing


      Have fun,

            Roy.


On 6 April 2018 at 08:52, Brian Sweetnam <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Pete,

In South Africa, I have to pay $45 for a Raspberry Pi 3 model B, and I see
that in Florida you can buy the same thing for $35.  It is way more
expensive here in South Africa.

The B+ has not released for sale in South Africa, because the relative
authorities have not yet given their stamp of approval, that will allow the
retailers to sell them - they do seem to already have stock of them, but
they are not allowed to sell them yet.

I hope you can get your Raspberry Pi 3 model B (or B+) soon. You can order
your here Pete:

Raspberry Pi 3 model B:
https://www.adafruit.com/product/3055

or
Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+
https://www.adafruit.com/product/3775

They are both priced at $35 for you.

However, for me, they would be as follows:
Raspberry Pi 3 Model B:   $45.06.
Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+: $48.47.

That is quite a big price difference for you and for me.

This morning I managed to start jOrgan on the Raspberry Pi 0 W, but I still
have to get the sound working - it is still quiet.

Regards,

Brian.





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Re: (no subject)

Brian Sweetnam
Hi Roy,

Nice to see you are still around.

It can't be that bad

Brian.



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RoyR
Hi, Brian,

               You haven't heard me play lately!   *:)) laughing

   Yes, I'm still around but not very active here these days. I've reached that cosy point where my jOrgan setup does what I want of it and, although it would be fun to carry on tinkering, I'm inclined to say 'if it ain't broke don't fix it!'

   The other side of the coin is me giving advice to others on the group. The problem there is my system/experience is largely irrelevant to what most people here are trying to do. I'm not that interested in authentic pipe organ sounds, I've built an orchestral organ, more on the lines of Technics/Yamaha etc home organs.

   A lot of problems and discussion centre around Fluidsynth or similar. My system has no software synth and little need to adjust sounds apart from basic effects like sustain, reverb etc. My sound source is a couple of Edirol SD-20 MIDI modules which have around 600 fixed instrument sample built in and no facilities to use any others.

   My use of hardware synths also bears on the present discussion in a way. From what I've read here it looks as if I could easily use a Pi 3 to drive my setup but my findings wouldn't be much use to anyone else. With no software synth it would put very little stress on the Pi resources, nor would I need the Pi sound system which is another source of debate, the hardware synths connect directly to the amplifier system.

   My other question is 'why do it?' What would I gain by making an ordinary desktop computer smaller when, to be playable, the main console has to be the size of a piano?


      Have fun,

            Roy.


On 6 April 2018 at 11:57, Brian Sweetnam <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Roy,

Nice to see you are still around.

It can't be that bad

Brian.



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engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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