MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

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MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

John Reimer
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I am creating this thread in order to move the appropriate posts to it.

John Reimer



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MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

morcc
How may one exit jOrgan, and/or shut down one's computer, from jOrgan,
using a MIDI piston or key?

Thanks,

Bill

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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

John Reimer
Administrator
morcc wrote
> How may one exit jOrgan, and/or shut down one's computer, from jOrgan,
> using a MIDI piston or key?

Bill,

By using the Nabble Search, I managed to locate a thread which started Oct
20, 2009. The link is
http://jorgan.999862.n4.nabble.com/Re-Save-or-Exit-button-td1000428.html

Actually it is a follow-on from this thread:
http://jorgan.999862.n4.nabble.com/quot-Save-quot-or-quot-Exit-quot-button-td1007726.html

It is a very long thread, which got hijacked OT towards the end, and so my
concentration waned, and I can’ t  say if it reached a satisfactory
solution. It is relevant to your particular question, but I did notice a
post from Sven (one of many in the second thread) in which he said this:
“there's no reliable way to shutdown your OS from a Java program”.

However, I also seem to recall that Lynn supplied a script which can turn
off the computer after jOrgan is closed down.

These two threads would be a good place for you to start.

John Reimer






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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

jbeach2646
I am curious about the flipside of the situation.  Is it possible to write a
batch file for Windows 8 or 8.1 which, on turning on a PC, would bypass a
password (or enter it automatically)  and start jOrgan and load a specific
disposition?   The reason I ask this is because I am preparing a PC for a
church and I would like for the organist to be able to simply turn on the PC
and have jOrgan start and load a specific disposition to be ready to be used
at the push of combination pistons.    Also, if a touchscreen monitor is
used for this set-up, in order to avoid the clutter of mouse and keyboard,
are there any recommendations for a minimum size?  I am figuring that a 24"
should be adequate.

John Beach



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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

jOrgan - User mailing list
JohnB:
All of that is easily done.

At run type: control userpasswords2 and check the user you wish to logon as
and then uncheck the "users must...." box.  When you OK you will be asked
for the password which will then go in automatically for that screen name,
until you do the same process and change it.

Then I would run some kind of macro or script... dependent on which version
of 8.1 you are using.
Marc-Paul

-----Original Message-----
From: John Beach [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2018 10:03 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [jOrgan-user] MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or
computer

I am curious about the flipside of the situation.  Is it possible to write a

batch file for Windows 8 or 8.1 which, on turning on a PC, would bypass a
password (or enter it automatically)  and start jOrgan and load a specific
disposition?   The reason I ask this is because I am preparing a PC for a
church and I would like for the organist to be able to simply turn on the PC

and have jOrgan start and load a specific disposition to be ready to be used

at the push of combination pistons.    Also, if a touchscreen monitor is
used for this set-up, in order to avoid the clutter of mouse and keyboard,
are there any recommendations for a minimum size?  I am figuring that a 24"
should be adequate.

John Beach



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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

John Reimer
Administrator
In reply to this post by jbeach2646
jbeach2646 wrote
> Is it possible to write a batch file for Windows 8 or 8.1 which, on
> turning on a PC, would bypass a password (or enter it automatically)  and
> start jOrgan and load a specific disposition?  

JohnB,

I have that happening on my console computer with its Windows 8.1. I have an
Organ "account" with no password, and W 8.1 allows you to set it up so that
particular programs run after power-on.  I didn't even have to write a batch
file (which I haven't yet learnt how to do). jOrgan can be set to open the
last disposition that was used.

Same thing on my church organ, which previously was the first of my analogue
organs back in the 1980's, but about 3 years ago I  midified it and
installed a W 8.1 laptop (touch screen) with jOrgan and the BROADWAY
disposition.

In each case all the organist has to do is turn on the computer, along with
the audio amplifiers. At church there are no problems if the organist simply
turns the power off when finished. At home I prefer to exit jOrgan first,
and I do that also at the church when I am playing for the service.

Does this fact give Bill the answer he is looking for?

John Reimer







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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

John Reimer
Administrator
John Reimer wrote
> Does this fact give Bill the answer he is looking for?

What I should have said is, "Does this fact give Bill the answer he is
looking for, if he takes into account the other things he gathers from those
two threads I mentioned?"

John Reimer




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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

jbeach2646
In reply to this post by jOrgan - User mailing list
Thanks to both John R. and Marc-Paul for the answers to my question.  I will
attempt to set that up today and see how it goes.

John B.



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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

John Reimer
Administrator
In reply to this post by John Reimer
John Reimer wrote
> At church there are no problems if the organist simply
> turns the power off when finished.

Sorry again. She actually turns off the computer first, by pushing the power
button. But it doesn't have to be held down for a few seconds. W 8.1 can be
configured to turn off safely this way, instead of the normal way via the
screen.

I needed the computer to be accessible and not headless, because I wanted to
use jOrgan features such as transposition and the Recorder. All standard
control of the organ is via the keys, pedals, stop switches and swell pedal.
The other organist takes no notice of the computer once it is turned on. And
as I have already mentioned, once it is turned on, it brings on jOrgan and
the BROADWAY disposition without having to be touched.

John Reimer




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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

jbeach2646
John R.,  So, I am assuming that the organist does not have to use a mouse
or keyboard at all?  Also, that the physical organ console has MIDI IN and
OUT and that you were able to effect virtual connections
from the physical  stops, couplers, combinations pistons, toe studs and
swell/expression pedal  so that the Broadway disposition responds to input
from the same?

This is not possible in my situation.  Although the organ has MIDI IN and
OUT, as "default" with "Power ON," I can not use the physical organ
console's preset combinations to effectuate changes to a jOrgan disposition.
I have attempted to use the internal memory of the organ to store a setup
of: ALL internal organ sounds OFF,  and ALL MIDI INPUT ON for the manuals
and pedal.  On shutting off the console power, and turning on again, the
memory defaults to the factory setting and replaces what I have saved in
memory.   This is a nuisance which requires physically shutting off all the
organ stops which "default" at "Power On," then proceeding to make changes
on the jOrgan disposition console.   For this reason, I am looking at 24"
Touchscreen monitors which, hopefully, will eliminate the hassle of
keyboard and mouse, as well as bypassing the problem of stop and preset
combinations on the physical organ console.   I output the jOrgan sound from
the computer to stereo, Auxiliary IN connectors so
that the sound from jOrgan plays through the organ's internal speakers and,
also, outputs to the main sound system, which has excellent, stereo output
as well as large, left and right subwoofers.   It is
perfectly capable of handling the power of organ sounds.

John B.



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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

John Reimer
Administrator
jbeach2646 wrote
> John R.,  So, I am assuming that the organist does not have to use a mouse
> or keyboard at all?  Also, that the physical organ console has MIDI IN and
> OUT and that you were able to effect virtual connections
> from the physical  stops, couplers, combinations pistons, toe studs and
> swell/expression pedal  so that the Broadway disposition responds to input
> from the same?

JohnB,

Yes to all except the MIDI In and OUT. The analogue organ was built into the
old pipe organ case, with new keyboards and pedals etc.  in 1980, the first
and prototype for a number I designed and built for Sydney churches. Two or
three years ago, when midifying it, I had to modify numerous contacts to be
reliable for the low voltage of the MIDI encoder. A “mio” MIDI to USB cable
from iConnect plugs into the small laptop, which is mounted to the left of
the organist, on a wooden bracket. It swings out from being across the music
desk, when the organ is not being used and the locking doors are slid
across.

John Reimer




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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

lwalls
In reply to this post by morcc
One of Sven's later enhancement add-ons was the implementation of an "Executor" element.
The Command property of the Executor element may specify any valid o/s command line
command or the .bat file.

Such command (which could be executed directly or included in a .bat file) would be
the "shutdown" command.  In Windows, at the command line, enter: "shutdown /?" to
see all the available options for the shutdown command.

And of course, the jOrgan Executor element may be activated via any of the usual
MIDI messages, or via an appropriately configured button on the console window.

CLW
---------------------------------------------------------------

On 1/18/2018 11:51 AM, BILL wrote:
> How may one exit jOrgan, and/or shut down one's computer, from jOrgan, using a MIDI piston
> or key?

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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

drwilx
See
http://jlmonsite.chez.com/MonSite/jOrganExecutorElements.pdf

Regards,

Dennis



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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

morcc
Firstly, thanks to many who have replied.  For some reason the replies never
got to my in-box, so they were not seen until today when I looked into the
forum.

Yes, one question here is how to accommodate organists without requiring
them to become computer literate.

In addition to jOrgan, I use the expensive program, and also the large free
program.  The former provides means for either exiting the program, or
orderly exit followed by shut-down, all under MIDI control.  Whether the
large free program has such capability is not yet known.

Beside accommodating organists who are not comfortable with computers, a
goal in addition to orderly shut-down, is to avoid loud pops potentially
that may harm speakers.

What is done here with the expensive program is as follows:

A.  A MIDI piston is assigned to exit the program and to turn off the
computer.

B.  A (fairly simple) custom circuit also, responsive to that same piston,
immediately mutes the amplifiers. Thus, when  the computer gets around to
shutting down, no pop issues.

C.  The amplifiers are powered through a solid-state relay that is
responsive to a computer power supply, thus when the computer shuts down,
the amplifiers follow suit.

Thus responsive to the single assigned MIDI button, silent and orderly
shut-down is achieved.  It would be nice to be able to do likewise in all
organ simulator programs.

Thanks,

Bill


 



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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

John Reimer
Administrator
morcc wrote
> For some reason the replies never got to my in-box, so they were not seen
> until today when I looked into the forum.

Bill,

That may indicate that you need to resubscribe to the Mailing List. I'm not
sure - especially as the Mailing List seems to accept your posts - otherwise
they shouldn't appear in the Nabble Forum. If you never receive any Mailing
List emails or Digests, that means you should examine your Mailing List
Settings.

Thank you for the information about speaker plops when turning off the main
audio amplifiers. In the church installation which I mentioned in this
thread, the output to the speakers is relay-controlled, and the organ power
switch, in combination with a specially-designed circuit board operating the
relays, makes sure there are no plops.

John Reimer




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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

morcc
Hi John,

Thanks for your help---I sent a new subscribe request just in case.

In beginning to investigate Dennis' suggestion, the shutdown command was
examined.  It seems just to do a shutdown, but with no apparent care about a
prior orderly closing of a running application.  Therefore a search was done
of how properly to close an application from the command line.
 
Apparently "taskkill /IM jOrgan.exe" would do this IF no child applications
were running.  But, it looks like jOrgan.exe spawns at least one child, as
that command did not shut it down.  Another switch may be added to yield
"taskkill /IM jOrgan.exe /T". which does kill the application, but the kill
may or may not be orderly.  No question about saving appeared, and the
command line complained that it was compelled to kill the child application
forcefully.

If this mode of killing is satisfactory, one might write a batch file to
first close the application, and subsequently to shut down the computer.
The batch file might then be executed by an EXECUTOR, responsive to a MIDI
piston.

As an ancient hardware geek with limited understanding of software, I have
no idea whether the closing thus accomplished prior to shutdown is safe.

Thanks,

Bill

   



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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

lwalls
Bill,

jOrgan.exe is not the real jOrgan process.  I think it is just the thing that STARTS
jOrgan as a Java task.  The thing that you want to kill with taskkill is "javaw.exe'.

When you "taskkill /IM javaw.exe /T", the jOrgan.exe task dies automatically.

CLW

----------------------------------------------------------

On 1/23/2018 7:46 PM, morcc wrote:

> Hi John,
>
> Thanks for your help---I sent a new subscribe request just in case.
>
> In beginning to investigate Dennis' suggestion, the shutdown command was
> examined.  It seems just to do a shutdown, but with no apparent care about a
> prior orderly closing of a running application.  Therefore a search was done
> of how properly to close an application from the command line.
>    
> Apparently "taskkill /IM jOrgan.exe" would do this IF no child applications
> were running.  But, it looks like jOrgan.exe spawns at least one child, as
> that command did not shut it down.  Another switch may be added to yield
> "taskkill /IM jOrgan.exe /T". which does kill the application, but the kill
> may or may not be orderly.  No question about saving appeared, and the
> command line complained that it was compelled to kill the child application
> forcefully.
>
> If this mode of killing is satisfactory, one might write a batch file to
> first close the application, and subsequently to shut down the computer.
> The batch file might then be executed by an EXECUTOR, responsive to a MIDI
> piston.
>
> As an ancient hardware geek with limited understanding of software, I have
> no idea whether the closing thus accomplished prior to shutdown is safe.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bill
>
>    
>
>
>
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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

morcc
Yes---"taskkill /IM javaw.exe /T" seems to produce an immediate and clean
exit---no error messages.

Thanks,

Bill



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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

jbeach2646
I have easily and successfully initiated the startup of of jOrgan with a
preferred disposition at the initial start of the Windows 10 OS by clicking
the Start button, in the "search programs and files" window,
type "shell: startup"  which will bring up the startup window (folder).
Right click in the window and select "create Shortcut," then, using the
"browse" button, navigate to C:\Program Files\jOrgan\
jOrgan.exe (it is the application with the jOrgan Icon, not the jOrgan Java
Icon (.jar).  This will place the jOrgan.exe shortcut in the startup folder.
You should not create a shortcut for java.exe, since
the jOrgan shortcut, itself, will start java.  I thought it might be
necessary to include the shortcut for Java in the startup folder in order
for jOrgan to work, but this is not necessary and, in fact, doing so,
brought up a black, "command prompt"-type of window from Java which served
no purpose.   It works just fine with the single created shortcut to
jOrgan.exe in the startup folder.

In jOrgan>View>Configuration>jOrgan, check both of the check boxes, one for
"Open Recent Disposition on Startup" and the next, "Save Disposition on
Unexpected Shutdown."  This will start a specific, preferred disposition at
Windows Startup.


Bill,  what is the procedure for the "taskkill /IM javaw.exe /T" message?
I, usually, close jOrgan, having saved the disposition, and then click
"Start" and "Shutdown."   I expect, some day, it will be possible
to hit the "Power" button and have automatic "Save"  (all work) and "Close"
all running applications with a subsequent shutdown.

John Beach


Yes---"taskkill /IM javaw.exe /T" seems to produce an immediate and clean
exit---no error messages.
Thanks,

Bill



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Re: MIDI controlled turn-off of jOrgan and/or computer

lwalls
Bear in mind that the "taskkill" method for terminating jOrgan will NOT permit ANYTHING to
be saved.  taskkill truly kills it before it even realizes that it's having an "unexpected
shutdown".

If you need to have jOrgan save its settings automatically before closing you need to send
it a "polite" request to shut down.

Lookup "nircmd" on the internet, download and install it.  Then invoke nircmd like so:
    nircmd closeprocess javaw.exe

This should send the Windows "close" request to java, and hopefully java will do a "soft"
shutdown of jOrgan.  I have not actually tried this with jOrgan, but it works for other
"normal" Windows apps.  The fact that jOrgan is a "sub" system running under java may
explain why jOrgan may not get the o/s "close" request.  Try it and see.

If this doesn't work there are other "messey-er" ways of getting a close request directly
to jOrgan.  nircmd may be able to help with that method also.  Use nircmd to "activate"
the jOrgan window (in case it is not the active window).  Then use nircmd to
"sendkeypress" jOrgan'S "save" hotkey sequence: Ctrl+S.  Then wait a second or two to give
it a chance to SAVE its settings.  Then taskkill it.

The reason for sending Ctrl+S to invoke jOrgan's "Save" function before killing it is
because, unfortunately, Sven did not assign a hotkey sequence for jOrgan's Close or Exit
functions.  Otherwise you could just send the hotkey for Close to jOrgan, and it would
save and close all in one operation.

Note, however, that getting jOrgan to "close" or "exit" on request does not always work
anyway because sometimes java/jOrgan gets "hung" on the MIDI interface for some reason,
and acts "frozen" -- even though it will often continue to respond to incoming MIDI
messages and play normally until you try to interact with it using the mouse.

CLW
---------------------------------------------------

On 1/26/2018 4:23 AM, John Beach wrote:

> In jOrgan>View>Configuration>jOrgan, check both of the check boxes, one for "Open Recent
> Disposition on Startup" and the next, "Save Disposition on Unexpected Shutdown."  This
> will start a specific, preferred disposition at Windows Startup.
>
>
> Bill,  what is the procedure for the "taskkill /IM javaw.exe /T" message? I, usually,
> close jOrgan, having saved the disposition, and then click "Start" and "Shutdown."   I
> expect, some day, it will be possible
> to hit the "Power" button and have automatic "Save"  (all work) and "Close" all running
> applications with a subsequent shutdown.

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