Fluidsynth failure

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Fluidsynth failure

simgilpat
Hi all and a happy New Year.
I am experiencing big problems now with Fluidsynth Failure messages in all
of my dispositions (including the fluidsynth test one!). I have checked I
have both Java 32 and 64 bit versions installed and trying to sort the
problem myself, uninstalled jOrgan and then reinstalled the 64 bit AMD
v3.20. I also reinstalled the various backend drivers options that exist for
fluidsynth, including the WASAPI 64 bit version. When, in construct mode, I
check the fluidsynth customiser, I can see the alternative backend driver
options and choose the WASAPI one. However, when I go to the fluidsynth
construct element in the disposition, under audio driver, I dont see any
options at all and have to type in portaudio manually. Similarly when I next
click on the audio device drop down box, I see no options at all for either
the laptop or my Focusrite external speakers.
I feel I have done something basically wrong but am wandering around in the
dark a bit.
Can anybody help please?
Simon




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Re: Fluidsynth failure

jbeach2646
Simon, in jOrgan>View>Configuration>Fluidsynth, make sure you see the
"default" and the Fluidsynth Portaudio backend version listed.  If you do
not,
you do not have the portaudio backend installed in the jOrgan>lib folder
correctly.  On opening the jOrgan>lib folder, you should see a fluidsynth
folder, inside of which should be a "default" folder with the portaudio
(dsound portaudio) backend, just as you extracted it after downloading it.
The easiest thing to do is to extract it, rename the folder "default" and
cut or copy it exactly into the empty Fluidsynth folder in the "lib" folder
of the jOrgan folder.

John Beach







Hi all and a happy New Year.
I am experiencing big problems now with Fluidsynth Failure messages in all
of my dispositions (including the fluidsynth test one!). I have checked I
have both Java 32 and 64 bit versions installed and trying to sort the
problem myself, uninstalled jOrgan and then reinstalled the 64 bit AMD
v3.20. I also reinstalled the various backend drivers options that exist for
fluidsynth, including the WASAPI 64 bit version. When, in construct mode, I
check the fluidsynth customiser, I can see the alternative backend driver
options and choose the WASAPI one. However, when I go to the fluidsynth
construct element in the disposition, under audio driver, I dont see any
options at all and have to type in portaudio manually. Similarly when I next
click on the audio device drop down box, I see no options at all for either
the laptop or my Focusrite external speakers.
I feel I have done something basically wrong but am wandering around in the
dark a bit.
Can anybody help please?
Simon




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Re: Fluidsynth failure

John Reimer
Administrator
jbeach2646 wrote
> Simon, in jOrgan>View>Configuration>Fluidsynth, make sure you see the
> "default" and the Fluidsynth Portaudio backend version listed.  If you do
> not, you do not have the portaudio backend installed in the jOrgan>lib
> folder correctly.

JohnB,

It appears to me that Simon has done this (re-interpreting the word,
“customiser” - I assume he is referring to “Configuration”:
“When, in construct mode, I check the fluidsynth customiser, I can see the
alternative backend driver options and choose the WASAPI one. However, when
I go to the fluidsynth construct element in the disposition, under audio
driver, I dont see any options at all and have to type in portaudio
manually.”

Simon,
Unless you have a good reason to keep Java 32-bit on your computer, I think
it would be a good idea to uninstall it (leaving Java 64-bit there, of
course). Also, would you mind going back to the Configuration, and choosing
“default”, then closing down jOrgan and restarting, and try to use dsound -
just to prove to us that you are at least getting dsound to work. Note that
whenever making a change to the backends, you have to close jOrgan and
restart it each time.

Please let us know how you get on.

John Reimer




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Re: Fluidsynth failure

jbeach2646
John R.,  I think you are correct.  It is somewhat of a problematic weakness
that jOrgan Customizer is redundant to Fluidsynth Sound (properties) which
contains the specified Fluidsynth instances, drivers and Sound device(s),
and buffers/size/polyphony and sample rate, bank number, etc.    With the
exception of the keyboard compass 36-96, all of the information given in
Customizer is input to Fluidsynth Sound Properties in the Construct mode of
jOrgan.   If you change "Gain" for Fluidsynth in the Customizer, that exact
change will show in the Fluidsynth Sound Properties.  The same is true of
buffers
and size.  Keyboard/Manual channel assignments are made in Customizer, and,
seemingly, these are constant while "tracks" to accommodate multiple
stops per channel are "floating," and not something we concern ourselves
with anyway.

I am not sure what specific reasons (as per the MIDI specification, logic
levels, I am guessing) may have necessitated the conception of Customizer,
Configuration and Fluidsynth Sound Properties as three inter-dependent,
correlative, but distinctly separate features.   It seems like they could
have been combined under Fluidsynth Sound Properties, eliminating
"Customizer and Configuration" entirely.

Perhaps, if Sven is monitoring our posts, he can explain why it must be
constructed in the manner it is.

John Beach

"JohnB,

It appears to me that Simon has done this (re-interpreting the word,
“customiser” - I assume he is referring to “Configuration”:
“When, in construct mode, I check the fluidsynth customiser, I can see the
alternative backend driver options and choose the WASAPI one. However, when
I go to the fluidsynth construct element in the disposition, under audio
driver, I dont see any options at all and have to type in portaudio
manually.”

Simon,
Unless you have a good reason to keep Java 32-bit on your computer, I think
it would be a good idea to uninstall it (leaving Java 64-bit there, of
course). Also, would you mind going back to the Configuration, and choosing
“default”, then closing down jOrgan and restarting, and try to use dsound -
just to prove to us that you are at least getting dsound to work. Note that
whenever making a change to the backends, you have to close jOrgan and
restart it each time.

Please let us know how you get on.

John Reimer"



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Re: Fluidsynth failure

John Reimer
Administrator
jbeach2646 wrote
> I am not sure what specific reasons (as per the MIDI specification, logic
> levels, I am guessing) may have necessitated the conception of Customizer

JohnB,

Redundancy is not always a bad thing. It may mean that a system is less
prone to failure. But in this case I am sure that Sven has done things this
way simply to make it easier for the user, experienced or otherwise. The
Customizer is a great asset. Instead of users having to set up a new
disposition by going into Construct mode and entering the appropriate MPL
messages (!!!!!!) and other details, the  Customizer does it for them. Using
the Customizer for setting Gain and Buffer values is also simpler than
having to go into Construct mode, where you really have to know what you are
doing. So "ease of use" is the name of the game.

John Reimer





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Re: Fluidsynth failure

simgilpat
In reply to this post by jbeach2646
John,
Thanks to both your inputs, I have now made considerable progress. I have
not yet deleted Java 32 bit as not sure if anything else using. I
reinstalled jorgan 3.20 amd64 and the various recommended fluid synth back
ends, such that I can now see them in the fluid synth customiser. I tested
the default as well to check the basic functions work and they do! I can
also see in the drop down box for audio drivers, selections for dsound and
portaudio and also can select my focusrite speakers via audio devices....so
much progress has been with your help and advice!
What I am struggling with and rather disappointed with is the quality of the
sound output. With quiet pieces and slow pieces, the delay between pressing
key and hearing sound is acceptable and the sound quite pleasing. With loud/
fast pieces, I am experiencing crackling and distortion and increased delay
in hearing sound. Are any of the fluid synth back ends better than others
and what are best settings for the various parameters in order to stop
distortion/crackling and minimise delay, or is it a question of testing
various combinations one by one?
Thanks as always for your advice and expertise.
Simon



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Re: Fluidsynth failure

jbeach2646
Simon said,
"With loud/fast pieces, I am experiencing crackling and distortion and
increased delay
in hearing sound. Are any of the fluid synth back ends better than others
and what are best settings for the various parameters in order to stop
distortion/crackling and minimise delay, or is it a question of testing
various combinations one by one?"

Simon,  what you need to do to stop those symptoms is:  in jOrgan
"Customizer"  on the window with the Fluidsynth  Soundfont(s)  showing
"Gain"  and Audio Buffers and Size, change the "Size" of the
buffers upward until the distortion/crackling and delay  cease to be an
issue.  If, for example, the "Size" of the Audio Buffers is 512, change it
by doubling to 1024.  If that eliminates the problem, leave it
there.


John B.



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Re: Fluidsynth failure

simgilpat
John,
Is it just the size of buffers and do I just increment in 512 each time, or
do I need to do the number of buffers as well I.e. Increment both. I don't
understand what the relationship is and hence whether it is best to have
lots of small size buffers or small number of big buffer size. What is
realistic range of these settings beyond which it has negative impact on
other attributes?
Thanks,
Simon



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Re: Fluidsynth failure

jbeach2646
Simon said,  "What is realistic range of these settings beyond which it has
negative impact on other attributes?"

The normal settings are in the area of 8 Audio Buffers and Size 128,256,512,
and 1024.   That is why I suggested that you try increasing until the
problem disappears.   I have had settings of 8/2048,
but with dsound, I find that I can do quite well with 8/512.

John B.



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