ANN: KOGARAH TWO - a new VPO for jOrgan

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ANN: KOGARAH TWO - a new VPO for jOrgan

John Reimer
Administrator

I am very pleased to release what will be my last jOrganVPO for quite some time - the KOGARAH TWO. This is an extended version of the VPO I released earlier in the year, which although having good basic stops, is deficient in having no upperwork at all, and in having no stops of the Principal family in the Swell Department. In this extended version it can be said that there are 22 speaking stops and 7 couplers.

In making the KOGARAH TWO, I have made use of the Great Principal 4' samples from KOGARAH, to produce the Great Twelfth 2 2/3' (perfectly tuned), the Great Fifteenth 2' and the Swell Mixture IV (perfectly tuned quints). This mixture, which is intended to add fulness of tone rather than extreme briliance, has also been made available on the Great by the use of what is effectively a coupler to that stop. The Swell Voix Celestes 8'  has been produced by adjusting the levels and pitches of samples of the Swell Salicional 8' from KOGARAH. The top octave sounds in the 2' stops and similar pitches in the Swell Mixture IV are produced from samples in the WEST PENNANT HILLS VPO, since the pipe organ at Kogarah has no sounds higher than the top octave of the Great Principal 4'.

Early in the year I recorded every second note of three stops in the Swell of the tracker  pipe organ at St Edmund’s Anglican Church in Pagewood, a Sydney suburb. I was the minister of that church from 1981 to 1994. Those stops are the Open Diapason 8', Gemshorn 4' and Trompette 8'. The two flue stops are almost certainly from a pipe organ made by E.F. Walcker of Ludwigsberg in the mid-1880's, and originally installed in the chapel of the Royal Prince Alfred Hospital, a major Sydney hospital. I used the Gemshorn 4' samples to produce the Swell Fifteenth 2'. I do not know the origin of the Trompette 8', which in this VPO I have placed in the Great (the Swell already has the Oboe 8'), and given it the name “Trumpet”.

To the Pedal I have added a Trombone 16', produced from the Trompette 8' samples and using one of the low samples to derive the bottom octave of notes. The three other additional stops, Principal 8', Bass Flute 8' and Choral Bass 4' have been derived by extension from appropriate Great stops.

Here is the link to the 189 MB zipped file:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/hbcivtjvxrvaqn7/KOGARAH_TWO_j320_FS.zip?dl=0

Comments and reports of problems will  be appreciated.

John Reimer
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Re: ANN: KOGARAH TWO - a new VPO for jOrgan

Aaron Laws
It's downloading now; I look forward to taking a look. Your introduction sounds promising.

You said "the last one for quite some time"; do you have other shareable interesting business to which you will be attending?


In Christ,
Aaron Laws

On Sun, Jun 11, 2017 at 12:52 AM, John Reimer <[hidden email]> wrote:

I am very pleased to release what will be my last jOrganVPO for quite some
time - the KOGARAH TWO. This is an extended version of the VPO I released
earlier in the year, which although having good basic stops, is deficient in
having no upperwork at all, and in having no stops of the Principal family
in the Swell Department. In this extended version it can be said that there
are 22 speaking stops and 7 couplers.

In making the KOGARAH TWO, I have made use of the Great Principal 4' samples
from KOGARAH, to produce the Great Twelfth 2 2/3' (perfectly tuned), the
Great Fifteenth 2' and the Swell Mixture IV (perfectly tuned quints). This
mixture, which is intended to add fulness of tone rather than extreme
briliance, has also been made available on the Great by the use of what is
effectively a coupler to that stop. The Swell Voix Celestes 8'  has been
produced by adjusting the levels and pitches of samples of the Swell
Salicional 8' from KOGARAH. The top octave sounds in the 2' stops and
similar pitches in the Swell Mixture IV are produced from samples in the
WEST PENNANT HILLS VPO, since the pipe organ at Kogarah has no sounds higher
than the top octave of the Great Principal 4'.

Early in the year I recorded every second note of three stops in the Swell
of the tracker  pipe organ at St Edmund’s Anglican Church in Pagewood, a
Sydney suburb. I was the minister of that church from 1981 to 1994. Those
stops are the Open Diapason 8', Gemshorn 4' and Trompette 8'. The two flue
stops are almost certainly from a pipe organ made by E.F. Walcker of
Ludwigsberg in the mid-1880's, and originally installed in the chapel of the
Royal Prince Alfred Hospital, a major Sydney hospital. I used the Gemshorn
4' samples to produce the Swell Fifteenth 2'. I do not know the origin of
the Trompette 8', which in this VPO I have placed in the Great (the Swell
already has the Oboe 8'), and given it the name “Trumpet”.

To the Pedal I have added a Trombone 16', produced from the Trompette 8'
samples and using one of the low samples to derive the bottom octave of
notes. The three other additional stops, Principal 8', Bass Flute 8' and
Choral Bass 4' have been derived by extension from appropriate Great stops.

Here is the link to the 189 MB zipped file:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/hbcivtjvxrvaqn7/KOGARAH_TWO_j320_FS.zip?dl=0

Comments and reports of problems will  be appreciated.

John Reimer



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Re: ANN: KOGARAH TWO - a new VPO for jOrgan

John Reimer
Administrator
Aaron Laws wrote
do you have other shareable
interesting business to which you will be attending?
Aaron,

Thank you for your interest. The simple answer is that I have no more recordings from which to produce samples! However, there is more to the story. A week ago I made preliminary arrangements to record an organ of nearly 20 stops in a Sydney church. I was delighted to be given permission in a very positive manner.  But even after the recordings are made, there will be six months work at least, in making the samples (I try to limit myself to only one hour at this a day, so that it does not take over my life). The church is on a busy road, so the traffic noise could be a challenge.

John Reimer
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Re: ANN: KOGARAH TWO - a new VPO for jOrgan

Andrew Larkham
Hi John,
If you are looking for recordings .......:-)
We have a small two manual Sweetland organ in our Parish church.
A couple of years ago I made recording of the 6 Great stop and Pedal stop.
Diapason; Dulciana; Clarabella, Harmonic Flute, Principal and Fifteenth.
plus 16' Bourdon
I put a disposition together - but couldn't get the samples to sound 'right'
I used Cool Edit to remove the background noise, and Vienna to produce the
soundfont
I made many attempts, but as this is not my primary interest - I gave up.
I think I recorded the 7 Swell stops as well - but will have to hunt for
them - or I could do them again!
(I certainly have one - an 8ft Keraulaphon)

If you - or anyone else? Is interested in finishing this project, I would be
delighted!
But it might take me a while to sort out the correct files!
More info here.....

http://www.npor.org.uk/NPORView.html?RI=T00460 

Andy

-----Original Message-----
From: John Reimer [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: 11 June 2017 13:03
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [jOrgan-user] ANN: KOGARAH TWO - a new VPO for jOrgan

Aaron Laws wrote
> do you have other shareable
> interesting business to which you will be attending?

Aaron,

Thank you for your interest. The simple answer is that I have no more
recordings from which to produce samples! However, there is more to the
story. A week ago I made preliminary arrangements to record an organ of
nearly 20 stops in a Sydney church. I was delighted to be given permission
in a very positive manner.  But even after the recordings are made, there
will be six months work at least, in making the samples (I try to limit
myself to only one hour at this a day, so that it does not take over my
life). The church is on a busy road, so the traffic noise could be a
challenge.

John Reimer




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65124p4665126.html
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Re: ANN: KOGARAH TWO - a new VPO for jOrgan

John Reimer
Administrator
Andrew Larkham wrote
If you are looking for recordings .......:-)
Hi Andrew,

Not if they are simply examples of English voicing, which yours do seem to be. I feel I have spent my whole life analysing English pipework! And I have promised to help Rick with his proposed recording of a Brisbane theatre organ. After that will come the one I have mentioned, a GERMAN organ, fairly modern, here in Sydney.

Noise is the big hurdle. My "Final Method" of sample processing is extremely effective in dealing with noise, as long as it is not too over the top. However, it is certainly not batch-processing. It is very labour-intensive, and takes me about 20 minutes for each note (but that includes everything - cropping the start, getting it in tune and well-looped, and then into the soundfont). And it can't work miracles, such as dealing with the noise of someone lopping trees with a power saw next door, as happened one day I turned up at a church.

John Reimer

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Re: ANN: KOGARAH TWO - a new VPO for jOrgan

John Reimer
Administrator
John Reimer wrote
Noise is the big hurdle.
Hi Pete (Theisen),

Thank you for your post suggesting it would be quieter at 3.30 a.m. of a weekend. It got into my Inbox but not here on Nabble! Actually at 78 years of age I do value my sleep, and I have no desire to risk altering my excellent sleep patterns, to say nothing about whether my concentration at that time of night would be equal to the task of playing the selected notes for 6 seconds and off for 4 seconds etc. and keeping up the pattern. Then there is that other matter - I have an organ friend who disagrees with my wife when she insists that I am obsessive about pipe organs and their substitutes, and I don't want to add fuel to the fire!

John Reimer
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Re: ANN: KOGARAH TWO - a new VPO for jOrgan

John Reimer
Administrator
John Reimer wrote
Hi Pete (Theisen),

Thank you for your post suggesting it would be quieter at 3.30 a.m. of a weekend.
Hi Pete,

Thank you for your further post (which likewise didn't make it into the Nabble Forum), in which you said -
"You don't necessarily have to go it alone. "One of your organ buddies must have 30 years of shiftwork behind him and
would love to find something to do at night when he can't sleep. If you can get access to the organ arranged, your nightshift guy could have the recordings ready for you in the morning!
"If I were in Oz I would do it for you. Except, night there is day here so . . ."

Thank you for your kind offer. But I do have a daytime job for you. You could visit the neighbours who live cheek-by-jowel with that church, and get permission to have THEIR sleep interrupted for some hours.
And Pete, you needn't point out that some people find organ sounds very sleep-inducing.

John Reimer
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Re: ANN: KOGARAH TWO - a new VPO for jOrgan

John Reimer
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John Reimer wrote
You could visit the neighbours who live cheek-by-jowel with that church, and get permission to have THEIR sleep interrupted for some hours.
.......and Pete said in reply,
"Really? The organ is strong enough that it can be heard outside? Now you HAVE to sample it!"

Hi Pete,

Well, that's not really my main criterion, but whatever the loudness, I do intend to record it.....at times which will allow me to catch a train home.

John Reimer
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Re: ANN: KOGARAH TWO - a new VPO for jOrgan

John Reimer
Administrator
In reply to this post by John Reimer

Mark has helpfully reported on the bottom few notes of the Pedal Bourdon 16' sounding strange. In some respects, he is quite right. Those bottom notes are all using the one sample - it is a Bourdon 16' sample where the fundamental is weak and the 3rd harmonic is very strong. I have included it as a "stored" sample in case people want to use it as I have done in the released soundfont, but it has happened in the release as an oversight. The original soundfont (i.e. the "authoritative" one) has normal and probably separate samples used, one per every two notes.

The reason I made this alternative available is that some people may have a subwoofer and listening room where the bass response below about A 55 Hz falls off badly (that is what I have, by the way). In such a case, using that special sample actually gives a better result, because of the strong 16' resultant produced if a good 8' stop is played along with the pedal Bourdon 16'. I shall leave the offending soundfont there for a couple of days, just in case some of you may be interested to hear these resultants. How well it works will depend on your particular circumstances. It actually needs a solid 8' to be played along with it. In my set-up, the Ped Bass Flute 8' along with it doesn’t quite succeed, but if you couple the Pedal through to the Great Open Diapason 8', you should hear it well enough.

This is not a new idea. I was interested when working with the KLOP samples some years ago to find that the Pedal 16' Sub-bass (or whatever it is called) showed the same quality in the lowest notes. I suspect that the builders did it on purpose, possibly because a smaller scale would take up less room. And a very long time ago, I read an article in a local pipe organ magazine where the writer discussed the virtues of a Bourdon 16', and he made this very point about the high level of 3rd harmonic being useful in giving the impression of deep sounds, if a strong 8' stop is also used along with it, to produce the resultant tones.

I shall correct this mistake in a few days, and will announce it when the upload has been done.

John Reimer
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Re: ANN: KOGARAH TWO - a new VPO for jOrgan

John Reimer
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John Reimer wrote
Mark has helpfully reported on the bottom few notes of the Pedal Bourdon 16' sounding strange. In some respects, he is quite right. Those bottom notes are all using the one sample - it is a Bourdon 16' sample where the fundamental is weak and the 3rd harmonic is very strong. I have included it as a "stored" sample in case people want to use it as I have done in the released soundfont, but it has happened in the release as an oversight. The original soundfont (i.e. the "authoritative" one) has normal and probably separate samples used, one per every two notes.
I have now uploaded the original soundfont within a new zipped file containing everything. It all has the original name, and the same web link should be used to download it:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/hbcivtjvxrvaqn7/KOGARAH_TWO_j320_FS.zip?dl=0

There is another reason why Mark found the sound of the low Bourdon 16' strange. They sound one semitone too low! I discovered that the bottom four soundfont splits involved have the Root Key of 41, but it should have been 40.

John Reimer
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